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Ukraine Update
20 October 2022
Lead MP
Ben Wallace
Debate Type
Ministerial Statement
Tags
UkraineDefenceEconomyEmployment
Other Contributors: 23
At a Glance
Ben Wallace raised concerns about ukraine update in the House of Commons. A government minister responded. Other MPs also contributed.
How the Debate Unfolded
MPs spoke in turn to share their views and ask questions. Here's what each person said:
Government Statement
The Minister of State for Defence, Ben Wallace, made a statement on the ongoing conflict in Ukraine. He detailed that Russia’s ground campaign is being reversed and it is struggling with logistics and recruitment issues. The Russian military hierarchy is floundering and its forces are resorting to attacking Ukrainian critical national infrastructure. The UK continues to gift air defence missiles to Ukraine, including AMRAAMs and NASAMS systems, alongside providing sophisticated electronic warfare equipment to defend against long-range drones and missiles. Additionally, the UK has trained over 7,000 soldiers and plans to train up to 20,000 more by next year as part of Operation Interflex. The Minister also mentioned an incident involving an RAF RC-135W Rivet Joint aircraft over the Black Sea where a Russian Su-27 fighter released a missile in its vicinity. The UK continues these patrols and has taken steps to avoid escalation, while maintaining support for Ukraine.
Luke Pollard
Lab/Co-op
Plymouth Sutton and Devonport
Question
Mr Pollard requested details on when the promised action plan outlining military, economic, and diplomatic aid to Ukraine will be published. He also questioned the decision to draw back troops from Estonia and asked if orders have been placed for replacement missiles.
Minister reply
The Minister of State for Defence responded by stating that he would provide a detailed update on the support package at an appropriate time. He did not comment on specific troop movements but reaffirmed the UK's commitment to NATO. Regarding missile procurement, he confirmed ongoing efforts to secure necessary equipment.
Luke Pollard
Lab/Co-op
Plymouth Sutton and Devonport
Question
Mr Pollard raised concerns about Iranian drone activity in Ukraine and requested additional support from the UK and its allies to intercept these drones.
Minister reply
The Minister acknowledged the threat posed by Iranian drones and emphasised that the UK continues to work with allies to provide advanced air defence systems to Ukraine. He also highlighted ongoing efforts to enhance electronic warfare capabilities.
Luke Pollard
Lab/Co-op
Plymouth Sutton and Devonport
Question
Mr Pollard questioned the Chief of Defence Staff's statement regarding a potential rise in defence spending, seeking clarification from the Minister.
Minister reply
The Minister clarified that the Government remains committed to increasing defence spending towards 3% of GDP but noted ongoing assessments of resource allocation.
Luke Pollard
Lab/Co-op
Plymouth Sutton and Devonport
Question
Mr Pollard inquired about the support available for civilian infrastructure protection in Ukraine, particularly focusing on energy sources.
Minister reply
The Minister emphasised the UK's ongoing efforts to provide both military aid and humanitarian assistance, including winter clothing and other necessities to help Ukrainians through the challenging winter period.
Luke Pollard
Lab Co-op
Plymouth Sutton and Devonport
Question
The shadow Minister thanked the Secretary of State for his statement on the RAF Rivet Joint incident, recognising its seriousness but also noting that appropriate steps have been taken. He highlighted the importance of avoiding escalation with Russia while continuing to support Ukraine's resolve against Russian aggression. Pollard acknowledged significant losses suffered by Russian forces and called for continued military training through Operation Interflex and a detailed action plan outlining future UK support, including military aid and economic assistance.
Minister reply
The Secretary of State responded that he did not choose the timing of his statement to coincide with opposition absence but remains committed to engaging with party leaders on sensitive issues. He confirmed that while one battlegroup will be withdrawn from Estonia, another has been extended for six months with enhanced capabilities including guided multiple launch rocket systems and air defence units. Wallace also addressed Iranian drone activity, urging Iran to cease supplying drones used against civilians, and noted ongoing efforts to develop counter-drone technologies funded by UK spending commitments.
Alicia Kearns
Con
Rutland and Stamford
Question
The MP thanked the Secretary of State for his consistent support for Ukraine. She expressed concern over the escalation in the Black Sea and asked about UK-Turkey collaboration on air policing.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace discussed Turkey's role, acknowledging a close relationship but stating that the Russian incident was likely due to malfunction rather than deliberate escalation. He emphasised the importance of maintaining professional ties with Russia despite recent tensions.
Brendan O'Hara
SNP
Argyll, Bute and South Lochaber
Question
MP expressed concern about Russian war crimes involving Iranian drones and asked when sanctions would be imposed on Iran. He also inquired about winter preparations for Ukraine.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace agreed with the MP's concerns, promising to follow up on winter assistance measures and reaffirming the UK’s commitment to addressing Iran's involvement in drone warfare.
Maldon
Question
MP asked if there was a risk of Putin escalating the conflict, including use of chemical or biological weapons.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace stated that using such weapons would have severe consequences and reiterated the UK's commitment to upholding international conventions against chemical and nuclear weapon usage.
Question
MP thanked Minister Wallace for his leadership and asked about support provided to Ukraine in logging evidence of war crimes.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace confirmed that the UK is working with international partners, including the International Criminal Court, to gather and log evidence of Russian war crimes in Ukraine.
Question
MP praised Minister's response regarding the Rivet Joint Sukhoi incident and asked about review of fighter forces.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace committed to reviewing fighter capabilities, stressing the importance of growing pilot numbers for new aircraft such as F-35s.
Feryal Clark
Lab
Enfield North
Question
MP asked about UK's provision of small diesel generators and equipment to Ukraine for winter.
Minister reply
Minister Wallace explained the process through which non-lethal military aid is coordinated, including support from international donor cells based in Germany. He promised to provide further details on assistance efforts.
Question
Commends the Secretary of State on his handling of the UK response to Ukraine and asks if he will keep the commitment to raise defence spending to 3% of GDP by 2030 under review given the increased security risks.
Minister reply
Acknowledges that threats change and needs must be reviewed accordingly. He commits to reviewing the situation as Defence Secretary based on changing threats.
Question
Expresses dissatisfaction with lack of transparency regarding recent meetings in Washington DC, questioning if there should be more disclosure about discussions with allies.
Minister reply
Clarifies that his visit to the US was crucial for discussing ongoing developments and ensuring a coordinated response. He assures that such discussions are necessary for strategic planning.
Question
Asks for an assessment of NATO's resolve in supporting Ukraine, particularly regarding long-term commitment.
Minister reply
Confirms NATO’s strong support and unity in response to the situation. He also notes that EU member states are increasingly adopting more hawkish stances to address the conflict.
Question
Acknowledges the Secretary of State's transparency, asks about current lines of communication with Russian counterparts and whether these have improved or deteriorated since previous assessments.
Minister reply
Asserts that communication channels remain possible but are complicated due to Russia’s focus on military activities. He assures continued effort in maintaining communication.
Question
Asks whether the commitment to reach defence expenditure of 2.5% of GDP by 2026 is right given current global threats, rather than waiting until 2030.
Minister reply
Reiterates that reaching 2.5% first is crucial for a sustainable path towards the ultimate goal of 3% by 2030 to avoid sudden and impractical financial demands.
Question
Expresses support for increasing defence expenditure but questions the progress on previous commitments regarding the size of armed forces and aid to Ukrainian civilians.
Minister reply
Stresses the importance of aiding Ukraine’s economy alongside military efforts. He emphasises the need for a balanced approach, focusing on capabilities, interoperability with allies, and strategic presence around the world.
Question
Inquires about the number of Ukrainian troops trained by UK programmes and future training plans.
Minister reply
Reports that 7,000 have been trained so far with targets to complete 10,000 soon followed by another 20,000-plus next year. He highlights ongoing efforts in larger unit training within Europe.
Hilary Benn
Lab
Leeds South
Question
In describing Russia’s increased targeting of Ukraine’s energy infrastructure, which we learned this morning has led to restrictions on power supply, the Secretary of State referred to the sheer quantity of cruise missiles and drones that are being used in those attacks. Is it now a question of increasing the equipment and capability he has announced to the House today to enable Ukraine better to resist those attacks, or are there other capabilities—he referred to some—that could be supplied or that Ukraine has requested?
Minister reply
From the international community, for example, Ukraine has consistently requested some of Israel’s electronic warfare capability. It is regrettable that, at the moment, Israel has not chosen to do that. I will be seeing the Israeli ambassador in the next few weeks to try to press the case. One of the challenges I have talked about is the proliferation of precision weapons into the hands of basically low-level troops. We have highly sophisticated, complex weapons that take months to make and were originally designed to shoot down fighter aircraft. When they are used against fairly cheap, mass drones, Ukraine will run out of them quicker than they can be replaced. That is one of the lessons, and it is why electronic warfare to jam, divert or take over these things plays an important part.
Question
I had the great privilege of attending a delegation to the Tapa British Army base in Estonia last week. There is obviously huge affection between the peoples of Estonia and Ukraine, as we saw when we had the great privilege of attending the Ukrainian ballet. I also met my constituent, Laurence, at the Tapa army base. He is in 19 Tank Transporter Squadron, and I asked him, “How can I help you? What message can I take back to the Secretary of State for Defence?” His whole thought was about the vehicles and how they are looked after, protected and maintained; it was not about himself. Will the Secretary of State join me in respecting the dedication of Laurence, everyone in 19 Tank Transporter Squadron and every one of those proud British armed services personnel working at the Tapa army base to keep us and the people of Estonia safe?
Minister reply
Yes. My hon. Friend was brave asking that question of a soldier—I have often had answers people did not expect. He espouses the real professionalism of our men and women. We were always taught, and I have never forgotten this, that it was, “My men, my kit, myself.” It is incredibly important that we have ready, capable equipment—that is the point I make to the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman): it is not just about mass and it has to be about things being properly serviced and maintained.
Jim Shannon
DUP
Strangford
Question
I thank the Secretary of State for his statement. It is encouraging for all of us in this House to know that we have a Secretary of State who is very much committed, in every sense, to ensuring that Ukraine has everything it needs. Is there any further support that he can and will make available to ensure that the damage left by the drone attacks that were designed to disrupt power and water supplies is repaired urgently? This might not necessarily be a Ministry of Defence thing, but this is about repairing the damage and ensuring that these supplies are not attacked again. Can he make that happen with any manpower, expertise and supplies, in order to thwart Putin’s determination to leave Ukrainians in the dark and with no water?
Minister reply
The positive side is that the Ukrainians are incredibly skilled at being able to fix, repair and build their equipment. In many cases they have managed to turn around the shortages of electricity in a matter of days and Putin has not been successful. On wider skills, I offered at one stage to send Royal Electrical and Mechanical Engineers, not into Ukraine but into neighbouring countries to assist with the refurbishment of tanks and such things.
Question
I agree with Members from across the Chamber in praising the right hon. Gentleman and his handling of the Ukraine-Russia situation. After the NATO Secretary-General said that NATO allies will act if Sweden or Finland comes under pressure from Russia or another adversary before they become full members of the alliance, how does the Defence Secretary predict that might antagonise Putin and what risk does he assess there to be for the UK?
Minister reply
If Putin attacks Sweden and Finland, the Russians will antagonise Sweden and Finland; I do not think they will antagonise themselves. If Russia chooses to lash out at Sweden and Finland, not only would NATO meet and discuss what it can do to protect some of its closest allies, who are choosing to join, but the UK has a number of security arrangements we have made recently with both Sweden and Finland, and we would ensure, even bilaterally, that we would step up to the plate. However, what we can see is that because of Russia’s poor and failing invasion of Ukraine, the conventional military forces it would have previously had near those countries are hollowed out or have been destroyed.
Shadow Comment
Luke Pollard
Shadow Comment
Luke Pollard expressed gratitude for the calmness and professionalism of Ben Wallace in handling the situation. He paid tribute to Ukrainian resolve against Russian aggression, noting Russia's heavy losses in the conflict. Luke acknowledged the UK’s support under Operation Interflex but asked for a detailed action plan outlining military, economic, and diplomatic aid to Ukraine. He also raised concerns about increased Iranian drone activity, questioned the planned rise in defence spending to 3% of GDP, and sought clarity on the replacement next-generation light anti-tank weapon missiles. The Shadow Minister emphasised the Labour Party's unwavering support for Ukraine.
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