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Abortion: Offences against the Person Act
15 June 2023
Lead MP
Edward Argar
Debate Type
Ministerial Statement
Tags
Justice & CourtsNHSNorthern Ireland
Other Contributors: 19
At a Glance
Edward Argar raised concerns about abortion: offences against the person act in the House of Commons. A government minister responded. Other MPs also contributed.
How the Debate Unfolded
MPs spoke in turn to share their views and ask questions. Here's what each person said:
Government Statement
The Minister stated that Section 58 of the Offences against the Person Act 1861 concerns administering drugs or using instruments to procure abortion. He acknowledged the emotive nature of abortion, affirming the Government's commitment to safe and legal access through NHS services in England and Wales. The Abortion Act 1967 allows for abortions within the first 24 weeks if two doctors agree that it is necessary on one or more specified grounds. Beyond this period, abortions are possible under limited circumstances. Abortions outside these provisions are criminal offences. The Minister emphasised that Parliament retains control over changes to abortion laws through a free vote.
Diana R. Johnson
Lab
Kingston upon Hull North and Cottingham
Question
The MP questioned how the Government reconciles differing abortion laws across UK regions, particularly Northern Ireland's recent decriminalisation. She inquired about medical bodies' concerns over chilling effects due to criminal sentences and asked if the Government reviewed necessary regulations for healthcare law changes.
Minister reply
The Minister acknowledged the long-standing position that Parliament decides on such matters through free votes. He noted that different regimes exist due to parliamentary decisions, and he emphasised that sentencing is a matter for courts while decriminalisation remains a House decision.
Question
The MP suggested advancing care for prematurely born babies could be an opportune time for a Government debate followed by a free vote to gauge the current stance of the House.
Minister reply
The Minister stated that scheduling debates in Government time is the responsibility of the Leader of the House, who will consider the representation.
Thangam Debbonaire
Lab Co-op
West Bristol
Question
The MP thanked her right hon. Friend for raising the issue of a tragic case and expressed concerns about the impact on vulnerable women seeking medical advice due to recent judgment. She asked the Government to review legal frameworks to prevent future incidents, including reviewing sentencing guidelines and public interest prosecutions.
Minister reply
The Minister acknowledged the complexity and emotional nature of the case but avoided commenting directly on the judicial decision. He highlighted that there is a legal framework for safe abortions under the Abortion Act 1967 and emphasised the independence of the CPS and Sentencing Council in their decisions.
Edward Leigh
Con
Gainsborough
Question
The MP warned about the possibility of legal rights to abortion up to birth based on recent tragic cases and suggested returning to a system requiring in-person appointments for safe abortions.
Minister reply
The Minister acknowledged the sincerely held views on both sides but noted that the matter had been debated previously, and the House had voted accordingly.
Alison Thewliss
SNP
Glasgow Central
Question
The MP expressed concern about the chilling effect this judgment might have on women's access to healthcare services in Scotland and asked if there would be support for decriminalisation.
Minister reply
The Minister highlighted that abortion is a devolved matter in Scotland. He stated it was not appropriate for him as a minister to comment directly on charging decisions of the CPS or to dictate actions of independent bodies like the Sentencing Council.
Martin Vickers
Con
Brigg and Immingham
Question
The MP expressed concern about the welfare of unborn children and suggested reviewing regulation for providers who send abortion pills.
Minister reply
The Minister acknowledged concerns on both sides of the debate regarding mother's health and rights of the unborn child. He stated it would be a matter for Health and Social Care Department to address.
Janet Daby
Lab
Lewisham East
Question
The MP raised concerns about legally valid reasons for abortion, citing a constituent's experience.
Minister reply
The Minister advised the hon. Member that he could not comment on specific cases but welcomed her to write to him for further guidance.
Desmond Swayne
Con
New Forest West
Question
The MP suggested face-to-face consultations as a measure against future issues.
Minister reply
The Minister referred back to previous discussions in the House on this matter, avoiding direct comment on specific legal cases.
Stella Creasy
Lab Co-op
Walthamstow
Question
The MP raised concerns about inequality in abortion rights across different regions of UK and asked for legal advice.
Minister reply
The Minister passed on condolences to those affected by the case. He noted that the House was aware of the differential regimes when it voted.
Bob Blackman
Con
Harrow East
Question
Regardless of one’s views on abortion, surely it must be that those women seeking an abortion get proper medical advice so that their health and the health of the unborn child are protected?
Minister reply
I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who makes an entirely sensible point. It is important that, when women make what is a very difficult decision, they have access to appropriate advice to assist them in making that decision.
Christine Jardine
Lib Dem
Edinburgh West
Question
Not only has a great deal of concern been expressed in this place about the case, but I am sure we have all received representations from constituents who are concerned and alarmed that this could happen. It has created uncertainty among women. What is the law? What are their rights? That is another reason why I ask the Minister to press for a debate in this place, so that we can address the law and reassure women about the situation.
Minister reply
This House has debated these issues on a number of occasions, certainly during my time in the House and during the hon. Lady’s time in the House.
Question
It appears to me that every time anyone comes to this place and speaks openly about the rights of the unborn baby, they tend to get shouted down and jeered at. I am pretty sure that this subject will come to this House again in the not-too-distant future, and I am pretty sure it will vote to relax these rules. But before it does that, I want this House and this country to think of those unborn babies. They are lives—after 6 weeks old, those babies are fully formed and it is just a case of them growing, as we continue to do when we are outside the womb.
Minister reply
My hon. Friend highlights again that there are sincere and genuinely held views on both sides of this debate. Respect for those divergent views must characterise how we debate what is an extremely sensitive issue.
Question
How is it possible that Roman Catholic Spain and Italy—home to the Vatican —have decriminalised abortion but we have not?
Minister reply
The right hon. Gentleman will know that different approaches are taken across Europe—for example, the UK has a 24-week limit; in most European countries that is much lower, at 12, 13 or 14 weeks.
Pontypridd
Question
In 2020, this House amended the law in Northern Ireland to remove the threat of criminal sanctions for any woman who attempted to end their own pregnancy. There is cross-party agreement in this place that more must be done to protect a woman’s right to abortion.
Minister reply
The hon. Lady knows that, as well as having a huge amount of respect for her, I consider her a friend.
Chi Onwurah
Lab
Newcastle upon Tyne Central and West
Question
The Minister says that abortion is “a matter of conscience” for the House, but it is also a matter of women’s mental and physical health. Surely Parliament has a duty to ensure that there is a consistent, humane and modern legislative framework that supports women’s wellbeing.
Minister reply
The hon. Lady makes a clear point about the divergence between the regimes of the two jurisdictions.
Warrington North
Question
I am hopeful that the Minister will soon bring forward something so that we can discuss this. As colleagues on all sides of the House have said, there is a need for a modern, fact- based discussion.
Minister reply
The hon. Lady makes a couple of important points.
Kerry McCarthy
Lab
Bristol East
Question
The Minister seems to be saying that if something is deemed a matter of conscience and subject to a free vote, it is never a matter for Government legislation and bringing it forward is reliant on private Members’ Bills or Back-Bench amendments.
Minister reply
The hon. Lady will know that on matters such as abortion and assisted dying, it has been a long-standing approach by Governments of both parties—hers as well—that those are matters for the House.
Jim Shannon
DUP
Strangford
Question
I thank the Minister for his balanced answers. If the right hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull North (Dame Diana Johnson) thinks that section 58 should be replaced because it was made a long time ago, why is she not asking for repeal of the entire Offences against the Person Act?
Minister reply
I know that the hon. Gentleman has strong and sincerely held views on this subject.
Shadow Comment
Diana R. Johnson
Shadow Comment
The Shadow responded by highlighting the case of a woman sentenced for ending her pregnancy under Section 58, calling for an open debate on outdated abortion laws. She questioned why Northern Ireland's women have different legal treatment after decriminalisation in July 2019. She also raised concerns about chilling effects due to recent sentencing and asked if the Government had reviewed necessary regulations for decriminalised abortions.
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