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Question
Wilson questioned the minister's response to the report, highlighting specific issues like children being strip searched at a young age without appropriate adults or public view. She asked if the Home Secretary would write to chief constables regarding PACE codes, implement recommendations for consistent adult presence during searches, and rule out strip searches in schools.
Minister reply
The minister acknowledged Wilson's concerns and noted that 95% of searches are on males and 75% on 16-17 year-olds. She stated that the Home Secretary is considering writing to chief constables about PACE codes, and she is seriously reviewing recommendations from the report.
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Question
Malthouse asked if measures to adhere strictly to guidelines on strip searches would inadvertently expose young children to greater exploitation by gangs who exploit them for drug trafficking.
Minister reply
The minister agreed with the concern and highlighted that adherence to PACE codes is crucial. She emphasised the need to balance policing and safeguarding efforts, stressing the importance of identifying and stopping criminal activity while ensuring appropriate treatment of young people.
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Question
Expresses concern over the strip search of children, citing a report by Dame Rachel de Souza which found high levels of disproportionality in strip searches and inadequate protections for children. Asks why the Government did not act on previous recommendations and calls for a fundamental review of PACE to address these issues.
Minister reply
Acknowledges the need for improvement but denies that the Government is doing nothing, citing recent engagement with stakeholders and commitments to review PACE codes as well as enhancing data collection.
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Question
Welcomes steps taken by the Home Office and emphasises the importance of stop and search powers for police in combating criminal gangs, especially in her constituency.
Minister reply
Agrees that strip searches are necessary to protect young people from criminal gangs but stresses the need for proportionate use of these powers.
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Question
Asks about training and supervision of new police officers to ensure they understand their duty to protect children from inappropriate strip searches.
Minister reply
Acknowledges the importance of education and training for police officers, stating that the Government is working with the College of Policing on this issue.
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Question
Asks how to ensure appropriate adults are present during strip searches when required by PACE code C.
Minister reply
Reiterates that PACE code C requires an appropriate adult unless specific exceptions apply, and acknowledges the need for adherence to these rules.
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Question
Asks about measures to protect mental health of children affected by strip searches.
Minister reply
States that proper consideration is needed before accepting recommendations, noting that most strip searches involve those over 16 and half result in finding illegal substances or weapons.
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Question
The shocking strip search of Child Q happened in 2020, coming to public attention a year ago. Why has there been such a lack of urgency and action on this issue, and when will the Minister guarantee that children will always be treated as children by police?
Minister reply
With respect, I do not accept downplaying the seriousness of this issue; it is very serious. The Government are working hard and take the matter seriously but proper consideration is needed before jumping to conclusions based on the Child Q situation.
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Question
What measures will the Minister take to address adultification bias in the police system which leads to black children being treated as adults and denied basic protections?
Minister reply
The Government agree that adultification of any child is unacceptable, regardless of ethnicity. Rules must be followed including appropriate adult presence during searches. Data collection is fundamental but initially voluntary.
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Question
When will the Government commit to compelling police forces to report annually on the strip searching of children, including information on ethnicity?
Minister reply
The Government are committed to improving data collection with the NPCC for future years. Proper evidence and data are important so annual statistical bulletins will include such information.
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Question
Considering Northern Ireland statistics showing disproportionate strip searches of children without appropriate adult presence, what steps will the Minister take now that there is no devolution in place?
Minister reply
If the figures are accurate, they are shocking. I will speak to the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland to see what more can be done regarding proper balance and usage of these powers.
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Question
Given personal concerns about strip searches, when will the Minister outlaw this practice for younger children and ensure appropriate adults are present?
Minister reply
Children must be safeguarded and treated fairly. Without an appropriate adult and parent informed, there needs to be exceptional circumstances; most searched are 16-17 years old.
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Question
Why have national standards on vetting, misconduct, and training not been introduced yet given serious issues with culture in the police as highlighted?
Minister reply
The Home Secretary is looking at these issues. Standards must improve urgently but it’s critical to maintain momentum while acknowledging that many officers are honest and committed.
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Question
Considering the damning report, when will the Government treat children first? Also, does the Minister consider strip searches in police vans appropriate?
Minister reply
The government acknowledges the seriousness of these issues and is committed to reviewing them carefully. Searches must be carried out appropriately but balancing this with safeguarding from gangs.
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Question
As a father of two young children, I am furious about the findings in the report that children as young as eight are being strip searched. Many will have been confused, humiliated and scared, with long-lasting impacts on their trust in police. Will the Minister confirm she will accept the Children’s Commissioner's recommendation for reviewing cases and referring them to the Independent Office for Police Conduct? Also, will she acknowledge 16 and 17-year-olds as still being children?
Minister reply
Sarah Dines highlighted that while very few eight-year-olds are strip searched in exceptional circumstances, the report is taken seriously. She acknowledged that 16-17 year olds are indeed still children but stressed the need to balance this with allowing police to do their job lawfully.
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Question
Instead of defending the indefensible, can she tell us how she will ensure that children are protected from what could be termed child abuse? Did she suggest body cameras during strip searches?
Minister reply
Sarah Dines stated it is child abuse when criminal gangs use children to carry weapons and drugs. As a safeguarding Minister, her goal is to save these children but also allow police to do their job lawfully. The Government will consider reviewing PACE codes C and A based on evidence.
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Question
The Minister's response has been partisan; all want children respected by authority, but there are huge variances across police forces. Can you comment on the data from Greater Manchester and what needs to be done for robust safeguards in every force?
Minister reply
Sarah Dines noted that every police force must act lawfully and there will be consideration of variances. She agreed with Gwynne's statistics, acknowledging that 13 out of 20 strip searches resulted in illegal items being found which is shocking but highlights the need for balance as children are often abused by criminal gangs.
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Question
For all of us, this is a difficult and sensitive issue. There seems to be a systemic problem; in Northern Ireland there were 53 strip searches with only one adult present from 2021-2022. What steps will she take to ensure a concerted and agreed policy for this UK-wide problem? Will she liaise with the Department of Justice in Northern Ireland?
Minister reply
Sarah Dines said she would work with the Ministry of Justice and reach out to the Secretary of State regarding reforms that apply everywhere, including working with Northern Ireland's Department of Justice. She stressed the importance of data collection for identifying problematic police forces.